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AzureSUCCESS
AzureSUCCESS
Jay Kumar, CAF Superstar
Listen in as Jay Kumar introduces us to Microsoft's Cloud Adoption Framework (CAF), the secret sauce behind many of of our most successful cloud migrations. Better still, Jay will discuss one of his own personal Venn Diagrams: converging high-end audio and marital relations.
ABOUT: Jay Kumar is a Sr. Cloud Solution Architect, who specializes on App and Infra at Microsoft. Jay possesses 15+ years of industry experience in Software Design and Development, Enterprise Architecture, On-premises and Cloud Infrastructure, DevOps, IT Operations and Service Delivery, and Program Management. At Microsoft, as a trusted adviser of his customers, Jay helps customers in their digital transformation journey and provide guidance for Digital Transformation, Application Modernization and Cloud Adoption and Migration.
LINKS: Cloud Adoption Framework, CAF - Microsoft Learn, Azure Friday – CAF Part 1, Azure Friday – CAF Part 2, Azure Academy – CAF Series, Cloud Assessment Tools, Strategic Migration Assessment and Readiness Tool, CAF Benchmark Tool, Find a CAF Partner
CREDITS: Louis Berman (Host); Jay Kumar (Guest); Dan Phillipson / PremiumBeat (Music); Anne Lamb (Intro/Outro); East Coast Studio (Editing)
MORE: visit https://azuresuccess.buzzsprout.com/ for additional episodes, plus transcripts, and more ways to listen to the show. As to your comments and suggestions, please feel free to email your host, Louis Berman, at lberman@microsoft.com
Then we are thinking about moving to the cloud. There is lot of strategy and there is a lot of people and process technologies have to come together. Everybody's going to be talking about some of their priorities and it is always good to have a facilitator to do this.
Intro:You're listening to Azure success, the podcast by and for Azure professionals. Listen in, and you'll be sure to speak to your customers March into the cloud. And now your host, Lois Berman. Hello, and welcome to another episode of Azure success. The podcast by and for Azure professionals. I'm very pleased
Louis S. Berman:To have my colleague Jay Kumar here today. I should say young Jay Kumar. Kumar means young in some Indian d ialect. Y ou'll have to explain, although he is not that young. I think, I mean, you're not that o ld, but you're not that young, right? I a m n ot t hat y oung, but the name stays. There you go. I'm of an age where any a dvantage I get particularly to be taken for younger, I'm going to take, s o anyway, we're here today to talk about Azure. Yes. Or maybe it's just Microsoft c alf. I don't even know t he name. Why don't you explain what h alf is and I'll try to not annoy you as the entire thing goes on. Just do your thing. Y eah. Sometimes people may think that because of our current season actually mistake f or and flu season, but it's not really t hat l et's not have anything Corona o n t he beer, which unfortunately I think is out of business. So what is the cloud adoption framework? I guess?
Jay Kumar:So cloud adoption framework is Microsoft one voice around how we are actually helping customers to come into cloud and adopt cloud business. So right now we know that we have lots of customers looking into digital transformation and the businesses such that we have technology omnipresent and customers are actually looking at different ways of doing things, how they can improve their existing products and their customer experience. And there is also thoughts around how we can actually improve technology, how we can make more money out of the business, all kinds of things. So adoption framework is actually not very simple thing in terms of like people think we can actually take and move to cloud. That's not really the way we work. It's a union of people, processes and technology. So we just need to have all these things coming together when we make an organizational change. So toward adoption frameworks are addressed to solve these things. And then we we'll address all these aspects in an organization, how we can make the change, how we can bring people together, how we can transform the business. That's all about.
Louis S. Berman:Now it's a big thing, right? I mean, how does one even start to approach it?
Jay Kumar:Yeah. There are multiple steps in doing this. So depending on your organization, sometimes people may be a little bit ahead of the curve. They may already have assets in the cloud. Some of them may be very new to cloud. So there is a place for everybody here. So we start with the strategy session for those guys who are all very new to cloud, come to the cloud. And then we think about why are we doing cloud? What are the drivers? What are some of the motivations around doing this? And then we have the next phase as the plan phase, where you actually look at your digital realistic, look at the current technologies we mapped into possible technologies that we can adopt. And then once that is done, usually we go to already phase where there is actually a readiness factor. Like it is basically making sure that within the organization, there is consensus. There is all sorts of collaboration happening across technology skill sets. The assets are to be aligned. People have to come together, all that is ready. And then we define the first project for the adoption. And that is called a landing zone. We actually create a landing zone for this. And then the next stage is called adoption. And the adoption can actually fork in the two different ways. It could be like a plain migration thing or it could be something like a innovation track. So basically in some cases, what we do is just lift and shift and minded as it is. Or we could think about using some of the five hours of migration, we call it three host, three factor, the architect retire. Really? That sounds like a lot of ours. That is a lot of ours. Yes. Yeah. That is really doing this. Yeah. So we could do that. And then that's the innovation phase. Like the adoption is pretty much rehosting, so depending on where they want to do and the motivations behind that. So let's say technology change and product modernization is their driver. Then probably they may go for innovation. If they are actually a data center, exit criteria, then they will probably go for a B hosting. Right. Just like they take everything and go into the cloud. Right. And then there are two other tracks which is called governance and management. Now there's lots of pieces. Right. For instance, there is documentation and videos. Yep. Can you talk about the pieces that come in the cloud adoption framework? Yeah. This is the process of how we do it. It doesn't say what we are doing. And there are also, we provide tools for doing certain innovation stuff and decision making process. For example, how do we do a digital real estate? And so we go into the customer's environment, we take what is out there. So we need to do a data collection and inventory control and things like that. So we lose several tools. For example, Azure migrate is another good tools that we have in Azure. We can actually install an agent on premises and start tracking what you have and build a portfolio. What we have, or there are other third party tools that we can use.
Louis S. Berman:That'd be like a[inaudible] thing. In other words, instead of our own tool. Yeah,
Jay Kumar:Absolutely. It is a pretty good tool so we can use all of those. And then just in the planning phase, when you're building up stuff for the migration, and there is also a cloud economics assessment process that we actually use some partners to help us that provides the customer like an end to end field around how this is going to ask them, what is the total cost of ownership? What is the steps involved? So they all actually use their intelligence of the cloud adoption framework could be, or not to face us, but there are tools that we provide. And obviously when you go into the governance and the monitoring of Azure, we also have our native tools such as Azure monitor and for security and analytics, we have Azure security center or Sentinel or all kinds of tools, or we can bring third party tools as well.
Louis S. Berman:Nope. This is a facilitated thing, right? This is not something that they necessarily can pick up themselves or have I missed that entirely? Could a client pick up the calf and do it themselves.
Jay Kumar:Usually they are very new to cloud. Then it's a little bit of a learning curve here. There is ton of documentation that we provide. If you go to aka.ms/adopt, you will calculate in the calf framework documentation. And we have lots of videos that help them to learn about that. But obviously when we are thinking about moving to the cloud, there is lot of strategy and let us, a lot of people and process technologies have to come together. Everybody is going to be, we're talking about some of their priorities and it is always good to have a facilitator to do this. And I think in that perspective, it's always good to have somebody driving this for them.
Louis S. Berman:Now I haven't checked. I assume there's an AKA M S slash CAS URL
Jay Kumar:It's adopt into of CAF.
Louis S. Berman:Okay. So I guess that's a way to be at the jumping off point for all of it. Well, so it sounds pretty good. I've attended a bunch of meanings around it. I've talked to you about it, but why as a customer, I want to adopt this, right? We are already going to the cloud. I mean, you're a cloud solutions architect. Do you specialize in app and infer? Can I just say, Hey Jay, get me into the cloud. Or maybe I have my own internal people, Hey, I want to get into the cloud. Why should you go with calf instead of anything else?
Jay Kumar:Yeah. So depending on the maturity model of the customer or the maturity level of the customer, they could B let's say they are in a high maturity, high growth phase. In that scenario, they are already in the cloud area. Really probably not need the cloud adoption framework when they need the governance model in some cases, right, they're already mature. They probably don't need the governance, but if they are not enough in their processes, one of the things that happened is that the customers can go into the cost overrun or the sort of unstructured way of doing things and go on and see is always an issue. So it doesn't mean that we have to go through the end to end process for every customer. This is a framework that all of us can use as cloud solution architects and apply in whatever phase the customer is. Right? So obviously in need not be applied all the time, but it is usually very much helpful at the time when they are coming into cloud. And it actually confuse a common understanding of the customer for the customer around the whole process and what we expect, where they lie, all kinds of things like that. So we just need to have this kind of a overlay of the process for them to idealize their situation.
Louis S. Berman:Got it, got it. So I have a bunch more questions for you, but firstly, I really want to talk about really expensive speakers. So it turns out that Jay and I were walking with a group of our CSA is, was last Friday. I think somehow audio file. And this came up and it turns out you used to be quite the audio file until your wife. Well, you'll tell us what did your wife do? Firstly, what is an order file? Why were you and how did your, what you termed user acceptance test or make that less palatable?
Jay Kumar:Yeah, absolutely. That's a good question. So you know, all your finally somebody who actually is so much passionate around the audio and there is a video file equivalent of that. The audio file people actually go and then find out the best technology, the best tools to provide a rich experience, that the audio, when you listen to music or movie or whatever, you get the best experience as the director actually envisioned for the output to come out. So there are so many things like the Dolby digital type of speakers that you can buy ELEAGUE there is 7.1 speakers. There is all kinds of speakers. So
Louis S. Berman:Translation expensive and expensive.
Jay Kumar:I believe it's expensive. You can always spend on month of your money on this actually. So that's the limit. There are like very, very expensive speakers and gold plated contacts and all kinds of things that you can also buy shielded cables. People like even quarry interference on the signal States going into the cable, into the speaker, like the speaker wires, right?
Louis S. Berman:I'd be ashamed to have non shielded cables, just the horror of it alone, just thinking about it. So I just want for our listenership, we're not merely technology folks. You know, we have lots of very interest. Well, it sounded very, very palatable until you guys started talking about the money about it. And it's like mortgage, it's a lot of money.
Jay Kumar:You got your priorities. Right? So basically what happened to me is that I was asking my wife to test out all these things. Obviously she's very interested in the music and all that, but beyond a certain point, there is nothing, much of a difference again, for the standard year. You don't get that kind of bang for the buck. So she was my user acceptance tester and the project manager and also the sponsor, maybe. So like a desktop. Yeah. So she said, okay, enough of this. And then you're shutting down this project. Yeah. Wow. Well, listen, I shut down calf. So let's talk about the next thing. We've talked about what it is a little bit and why the customer should be interested. I'm very interested in how you make the sale to the customer. I know it's not a thing you're spending money on, but how do you convince the customer that cash it's worth their time? Yeah. So the first thing that we always do is like educate them about calf, right? So in the senior leadership, when they are trying to go into cloud and doing the migration process, nobody wants to just do a random bunch of stuff, right. They don't want to like, have their developers go sideward or like, you know, do any direction and then start doing it. And usually happens is that when the cloud came in first time, developers were so much happy that they have an environment that they can orchestrate and play with. And so suddenly the cost of the company, they are going to have an overrun on their budget with the people, just creating stuff and then playing with that. So there has to be a purpose for what we are doing. These things are. So we just need to clearly identify and define the intent, the motivation, the business outcome, all that kind of stuff. Right? So that is the value of this. Like basically they actually aligns the thought process. It actually brings everybody together. It provides that project plan and it gives visibility to what they're doing, all kinds of things. And so that's kind of pitch that we need to do for the executed leadership pretty much. And what sort of person would you likely pitch? Yeah, I'm an organization, a business person, a technical person. Who do you talk to likely success. This actually has to come from the CTO type person or the CIO. And those guys have to think about like, first of all, if they are not even thinking about digital transformation, it starts with the digital transformation discussion, right? We are talking about technology being omnipresent everywhere and changing the way we do things and doing a lot of disturbance in their disruption, for example. So they have to really think about, you know, that the Microsoft philosophy around like engage your product and get your customers innovation of products like engage your employees, all kinds of things that we do for bringing the company to the next level. So when we talk about technology, we also thinking about how we modernize the shop and then for different reasons. So we just talk about these things and then once these technologies are buying into this idea of going to a digital transformation, especially in the cloud, they need to get the support from their business partners. So we just need to help them out to sell this to their business folks. And then once the strategy is set, then we will talk to our next level of middle management because can the directors and those guys who are actually during the planning and execution. So it's a trickle down effect there. We have to talk to different levels. And then first of all, the strategies has to be done at the top level. And then the execution has to happen. And then finally implementation who is going to be the actual developers and the it folks.
Louis S. Berman:So now I want you to sell it to me, right? I'm your colleague, we're actually on the same team. Why should I spend my time on it as someone, not one of those CIO is a CTO. Is it going to work out well for me? Right. And I have very little time to do my job as is. Why should I do it?
Jay Kumar:Let me ask you in that. So if you are not thinking about it, what is your future plan around your it portfolio? Like, are you going to stay in the, on premises environment or what is your longterm goal and how do you see your company going from today in another or one year or like six months to one year?
Louis S. Berman:Got it. So I don't know I'm new to this. I'm pretending to be new. I hope I'm not new. That'd be very embarrassing.
Jay Kumar:So I would say that first of all, the way of doing things, if you are confined to your own premises with a bunch of star Wars that is not going to scale, you cannot add more users or even your customers to your business. You cannot do the most modern types of apps. You cannot give data rich applications. You cannot provide analytics. Nowadays customers are looking at rich applications. Like they have a mobile it's obligations, all those things. And if you are not looking at all those things, somebody else is going to provide a better customer experience and you will not be able to catch up.
Louis S. Berman:Well, that's cool. I'm convinced I'm sold. So thank you very much. I'm a soft sell.
Jay Kumar:You are my friends. So you're helping me here.
Louis S. Berman:Yeah. So I think it's really important to understand. Very often we talk about, I know, know these top of mind sort of announcements from Microsoft and whether it be all these efforts around power tools and power toys or unifying desktop windows apps with UWP or whatever, pick any dimension that you want to pick up and there's headlines around it. But I'm sort of, of the opinion from everything I know about calf, it feels like a sort of work a day thing that really punches above its weight. Right? I always love to tell the story. Dev ops is my area. I love to tell the story that Microsoft, when I joined five or so years ago was finally not struggling to create software at the speed and pace that we wanted to. And we weren't by no means at the level where we are right now, but it is because we're better at being in the cloud because we're better at constructing. Things are better at just collaborating better at coalescing individual pieces of code capabilities, into applications and services. I think this stuff punches way above its weight, it is enablement in the best sense of the word. And so thank you for coming on and talking about this. Speaking into, I sound so official. I I'm speaking with cloud solutions architect, Trey Kumar about the cloud adoption framework, and you should look into it and is a K a M S slash what was the word and adopt, adopt. And I'm sure you'll be pleased. You did. Thank you, Jane. Thank you so much, Louis.
Outro:You've been listening to Azure success, the podcast by and for Azure professionals, you can visit our website, azure-success.com for show notes, helpful links and other episodes, but also to leave your questions, comments, and suggestions. Thank you for listening.